RavenBlog
Black:  ravenblack.net | me | games | books | email | wishlist | rss
Blogs:  Angryblog | As Above | MonkyBlog | Nightshade | Journals
Blimey:  SomethingAwful | Advice
Archives: Last 4 Days | June2001 | July2001 | August2001 | September2001 | October2001 | November2001 | December2001 | January2002 | February2002 | March2002 | April2002 | May2002 | June2002 | July2002 | August2002 | September2002 | October2002 | November2002 | December2002 | January2003 | February2003 | March2003 | April2003 | May2003 | June2003 | July2003 | August2003 | September2003 | October2003 | November2003 | December2003 | January2004 | February2004 | March2004 | April2004 | May2004 | June2004 | July2004 | August2004 | September2004 | October2004 | November2004 | December2004 | January2005 | February2005 | March2005 | April2005 | May2005 | June2005 | July2005 | August2005 | September2005 | October2005 | November2005 | January2006 | February2006 | March2006 | April2006 | May2006 | June2006 | July2006 | August2006 | September2006 | October2006 | November2006 | December2006 | January2007 | February2007 | March2007 | April2007 | May2007 | June2007 | July2007 | August2007 | September2007 | October2007 | November2007 | December2007 | January2008 | February2008 | March2008 | April2008 | May2008 | June2008 | July2008 | August2008 | September2008 | October2008 | November2008 | December2008 | January2009 | March2009 | April2009 | May2009 | July2009 | August2009 | September2009 | February2010 | March2010 | June2010 | July2010 | August2010 | September2010 | October2010 | November2010 | December2010 | February2011 | March2011 | April2011 | May2011 | June2011 | July2011 | August2011 | September2011 | October2011 | December2011 | March2012 | April2012 | May2012 | September2012 | December2012 | March2013 | April2013 | May2013 | June2013


Comments on Wednesday 3 November 2004:
On the first of November, I saw a time travel bus in town, destination: MERRY CHRISTMAS. As a card-carrying bah-humbugger, I didn't get on the bus, though in retrospect perhaps riding swiftly past all the November and December decorations and music would have been a good idea. [04:38]

Annie
right on hoo rah

Khandi
I am so tempted to log on to City of Heroes and make a character called 'The Bah-Humbugger'.

Kilikina
If you don't believe in Christmas, why are you carring a card? wouldn't that be hypocrisy?

RavenBlack
Who said I don't believe in Christmas? I know it exists, I see about three months of evidence every year.

Kilikina
Unless you're a christian, which you said you aren't, you can't believe in anything other than recieving gifts and perhaps a buisier or more polite time of year. Which is not the true concept of Chirstmas

RavenBlack
More polite? Where have you been experiencing Christmas?

As a non-Christian I do, in fact, believe in things other than receiving gifts.

But you're right, I don't believe in nailing people to planks for sedition and then celebrating it every year for two thousand years.

Kilikina
Yes polite! And I experience it in the agnostic city of Ventura. And if you have ever cared to notice it, celebrating "nailing people to planks for sedition" is what Easter is for. Christmas is the calebration of the person's birth who they nailed to a plank. Come to think of it, seditoin isen't even the appropriate word, it means rebelling or resisting, and said person wasn't necessarily doing such.

RavenBlack
Isn't Easter about the whole rising from the dead as a zombie thing? Christmas isn't about any of it anyway, it's a pagan festival with 'Christ' shoved into the name.

Anyway, back to the original point, I wasn't carrying a *christmas* card, I was just carrying a card. Several, in fact. One of them is a bus card which I might have been able to use to get on the MERRY CHRISTMAS bus, which I suppose might make it a Christmas card of sorts, but not in a hypocritical way.

RavenBlack
Hm, correction to my earlier statement - I *do* believe in nailing someone to a plank and then celebrating it for thousands of years, because I've seen the evidence. What I don't believe is that it's a good idea.

Kilikina
Christmas is not a "pagen festival with 'Christ' shoved into the name". First, pagen means 'heathen' and christians are the ones who made up that word, and they inented Christmas, thus it is not *pagen*. And the whole idea of believing in "nailing someone to a plank an then celebrating it for a thousand years" is the story behind it and if it is true. It in fact has nothing to do with whether or not it is a good idea. But thank you for clarifing that it was not a general 'merry christmas card', I would hate to think of you as a hypocrite.

RavenBlack
Christians didn't invent Christmas, they renamed it. It was a winter solstice festival, Yule. Where did Christians get the exchange of gifts and the decorated tree from, in your imaginary history? It's not in the Bible. Easter, similarly, was a festival predating Christianity, worshipping the Saxon fertility goddess Eostre, hence the name. Where does the word "Easter" come from in your imaginary Christian origins? What do eggs and bunnies have to do with zombie Christ?

Kilikina
I'm aware of that, what I ment was they made it what it is today. They stole it and changed the meaning of it; there is absolutely nothing new under the sun. And as for all the bunnies and trees you speak of, they are simply kept around as tools in which people can make money from and no longer have any other value than cutesy little traditions that are "for the whole family". The gift exchange was kept in hopes that they could turn the holiday into celebrating Christ's birthday and that one would gifts out of the goodness of their heart, therefore making their God happy. Altough, since practicaly no one mantains such principles, these things are still maintained for the economy's sake, superstitions, and in hopes of not offending anyone.

RavenBlack
Ah, so *that's* the true meaning of Christmas. Superstitions and not offending anyone.

Kilikina
In general, yes, but there are too many viewpoints for only one meaning of it. The question, "What is the true meaning Christmas?" goes right up there with, "What do women *really* want?" (And if you are being sarcasitc: well played, Sempi!)

Digi
I'd say Coca-Cola have had more influence on todays Christmas than Jesus ever did.

(Assuming, of course, the urban legend about them inventing red Santa isn't an urban legend at all. Which reminds me, at this time of year you should all be breaking out your copies of Black XXX-Mas. Available from www.blackxxxmas.com )

Khandi
The red Santa was established as the 'main' Santa in the 1920's, Coca-Cola didn't start using him until the 40's. Coca-Cola's contribution was that they were the first to commercialize Santa, Hallmark jumped on that bandwagon pretty quick.
Even if you love Christmas, is it really necessary to start celebrating it the day after Hallowe'en?

Digi
I'm not accepting that. I like the urban myth, so I'm deciding it's true, no matter what evidence you may tender.

Dhani
Yeah so I was looking up dreams in Google and came across your site blob thing. You have a lot of interesting thoughts, pictures, etc. I like...

ancient ancestress
does anyone know the meaning behind exchanging gifts for the solstice? where it came from?

booradley666
i must have had learning disabilities....but I just wanted to clarify that the word "pagan" stems from ancient Greece? Rome? I've forgotten which - but it refers to somebody, a group of people, who were outside of the city-state. Pagan literally means that somebody is from the country. Pagans were shunned because they held onto their community traditions while the city dwelling populace practiced their worship of mercury, jupiter, so on and so forth. Soltices are agricultural events and not religious, since any agrarian society naturally orients its lifestyle around the seasons. Religious meaning sprang forth from the masses in the cities, living a consumer/money-dependent lifestyle and having too much time on their hands. They looked back into history and legend to find a reason to justify a "pagan" holiday. Seasons are still important to some people, but now we are referred to as "hicks".

SneAdEy92
Xmas is Good! if ya get the presents and you have a fun time what is the real point of complaining? Yes, maybe it is a bit O.T.T but it only happens once a year so why not celebrate instead of Moan?

Kewlness
Christmas is a time to get together with family and friends and what other time can you do that! Christmas has a very festive atmosphere and that is created by the commercial industry

RavenBlack
But what if I get presents and a *more* fun time when it is not Christmas? Therein lies the point in moaning. Also I have more fun moaning about it than I would celebrating it.

I can get together with family and friends at *any* other time. July, for example, in which I visited my father and some of my best friends. I won't be visiting any such people at Christmas.

pagen
heathen um pagen was around long before christian it truly means peasent'therefore perhaps research before judgement may save you ignorance and embarassment stay off line until you have something worth while to read.

RavenBlack
It would be helpful, misspelled pagan, if you would specify which commenter you're talking to, since three people said stuff that agrees with you and only one said otherwise (and I wasn't that one, and it's my blog so I'm the default 'you' if not specified).
Add Comment:
Name:Comment: (max. 2048 characters)
Email:
Show Email: (if no website)
Website:
No HTML tags allowed.
(Antispam) What is 40 + 37?
Archives: Last 4 Days | June2001 | July2001 | August2001 | September2001 | October2001 | November2001 | December2001 | January2002 | February2002 | March2002 | April2002 | May2002 | June2002 | July2002 | August2002 | September2002 | October2002 | November2002 | December2002 | January2003 | February2003 | March2003 | April2003 | May2003 | June2003 | July2003 | August2003 | September2003 | October2003 | November2003 | December2003 | January2004 | February2004 | March2004 | April2004 | May2004 | June2004 | July2004 | August2004 | September2004 | October2004 | November2004 | December2004 | January2005 | February2005 | March2005 | April2005 | May2005 | June2005 | July2005 | August2005 | September2005 | October2005 | November2005 | January2006 | February2006 | March2006 | April2006 | May2006 | June2006 | July2006 | August2006 | September2006 | October2006 | November2006 | December2006 | January2007 | February2007 | March2007 | April2007 | May2007 | June2007 | July2007 | August2007 | September2007 | October2007 | November2007 | December2007 | January2008 | February2008 | March2008 | April2008 | May2008 | June2008 | July2008 | August2008 | September2008 | October2008 | November2008 | December2008 | January2009 | March2009 | April2009 | May2009 | July2009 | August2009 | September2009 | February2010 | March2010 | June2010 | July2010 | August2010 | September2010 | October2010 | November2010 | December2010 | February2011 | March2011 | April2011 | May2011 | June2011 | July2011 | August2011 | September2011 | October2011 | December2011 | March2012 | April2012 | May2012 | September2012 | December2012 | March2013 | April2013 | May2013 | June2013